Topic: Some Cities Do Not Deserve the NHL

[Small Town]

Just caught the last half of the 3rd period of the Dallas - Calgary game.  This is after watching the NHL Prospects game and attending to some of life's tasks. 

Allegedly the NW division is tight and Dallas should be pushing San Jose as they are on the wrong side of home ice advantage if the playoffs were decided today.  Calgary needs / wants a win.  Why are there so many good seats empty for this game???   For crying out loud, last night, after getting some serious weather, with Washington coming into town on a cold Tuesday night, the Scotia Bank Place was only a few hundred seats short of a sellout. 

Some cities just don't appreciate the game - the league should pull these franchises before the small markets like Ottawa are forced to subsidize these poor business decisions.  Clearly these citiies have no idea about hockey. 

Discuss!

[SzuperChicky]

I don't understand how Washington and Pittsburgh draw such low crowds with guys like Malkin, Crosby, Ovechkin, Semin, etc.  Just mindboggling.

[Broken Bones]

I think the NHL needs to step in and put in a clause saying "If for two (or three) consecutive years the attendance of a team is below X % of the maximum capacity of their home arena, and not ending the fiscal year with an account balance of zero or above, that team will be moved."

However, the big question would be "where"? There are some owners out there that have the money to subsidize their losses, unfortunately, they won't have to now that the league has revenue sharing in place.

In the end, it should be the owners decision on weather to move the team or not, and then the NHL for approval. And lets face it, we won't ever see an NHL team MOVE to Canada, maybe one might pop up in a future expansion bid, but not one will move. Bettman would rather see the NHL struggle in souther markets, as he seems to have fears of success in the north.

[RideauDreaming]

The NHL is just daft at marketing games and scouting markets. They also need to realise that they'd be better off selling out 15 or 16,000 people in true hockey markets than getting 10,000 in a bigger market. The NHl is miles behind the other major sports and its slipping. I really don't know why there hasn't been a top management clean-out.

[Special J]

In the end, it should be the owners decision on weather to move the team or not, and then the NHL for approval. And lets face it, we won't ever see an NHL team MOVE to Canada, maybe one might pop up in a future expansion bid, but not one will move. Bettman would rather see the NHL struggle in souther markets, as he seems to have fears of success in the north.

I think we saw proof of this with the Pittsburgh Penguins.  And as long as the little weasel is in charge forget expansion to Canada too.

[thirstymoose_2000]

A lot of the American rinks don't start filling up until after the Super Bowl. Dallas has been a pretty good market for the NHL.

Nashville, Florida and a couple others are questionable markets.

We keep talking about another franchise in Canada and we wax elequent about the 'Peg, but in reality other than their last season they weren't above 80%-90% capacity most of the time in a small arena. Their current arena only holds ~15k and it is not equiped with the boxes and immenities required by NHL clubs.

The best markets would be Hamilton/Waterloo/St Catherines area - but the Sabres and Leafs would never allow that.

[Special J]

The best markets would be Hamilton/Waterloo/St Catherines area - but the Sabres and Leafs would never allow that.

My understanding is that these teams enjoy no such protected status in the Kitchener-Waterloo-London region.

[Metalhawk]

My understanding is that these teams enjoy no such protected status in the Kitchener-Waterloo-London region.

London is only one hour away from Toronto...

[Special J]

Maybe the way you drive. 

It's about 160km from city limit to city limit.  Add time for getting in and out of the the respective cities it is well over an hour. Anyways, I don't know what the actual distence is that is protected, but I did see an article susggesting it was 80km.  That does seem small though.

I could be wrong about whether the area is protected or not.  But I got the impression when the Pens gold sold the first time that it would be much easier to move to this region rather than Hamilton because of this issue.

[rose]

For the love of god, get a "real" hockey man as the next commissioner....Brendan Shanahan might be an interesting choice.

I am sick and tired of having the game influenced by what happens (or doesn't) in the US markets.  Sorry....it has been years since expansion into the US (into some pretty questionable areas, IMHO) and the NHL still is barely a blip on the US radar screen in terms of "Major" sports.  While I have bought into some of the changes that have ensued since Bettman was put in charge, the reality is the constant changes to the game are becoming tiresome, particularly when they are being more and more geared to the fans in the US "tastes".  Gimme a break! 

It will, however, be interesting to see the attendance figures for US teams once the Super Bowl is over and done with.  There typically is an increase in some markets once that perpetually over-hyped game has played itself out.

[Metalhawk]

Maybe the way you drive. 

It's about 160km from city limit to city limit.  Add time for getting in and out of the the respective cities it is well over an hour. Anyways, I don't know what the actual distence is that is protected, but I did see an article susggesting it was 80km.  That does seem small though.

I could be wrong about whether the area is protected or not. But I got the impression when the Pens gold sold the first time that it would be much easier to move to this region rather than Hamilton because of this issue.

Well, I never actually did London-Toronto per se, but I used to live in Sarnia, and Sarnia-Toronto was about 2 hours and a few minutes, and Sarnia-London was an hour...

[sbaldrick]

The reason the Dallas game wasn't packed is because of a massive ice-storm they had in the Dallas area.    The game itself was sold out but fans couldn't get that.  The stars are a huge draw and outdraw the Mavericks (basketball) on a regular bases.

[Broken Bones]

The reason the Dallas game wasn't packed is because of a massive ice-storm they had in the Dallas area.    The game itself was sold out but fans couldn't get that.  The stars are a huge draw and outdraw the Mavericks (basketball) on a regular bases.

And yet, we have ice storms and bad winter weather on a regular basis here, and teh rinks are almost always full.

[playertobenamedlater]

And yet, we have ice storms and bad winter weather on a regular basis here, and teh rinks are almost always full.

... but we're used to winter weather, and nobody in Dallas has snow tires. There are a few cities that don't deserve their teams, but Dallas has always been very supportive of the Stars.

For the love of god, get a "real" hockey man as the next commissioner....Brendan Shanahan might be an interesting choice.

I am sick and tired of having the game influenced by what happens (or doesn't) in the US markets. Sorry....it has been years since expansion into the US (into some pretty questionable areas, IMHO) and the NHL still is barely a blip on the US radar screen in terms of "Major" sports. While I have bought into some of the changes that have ensued since Bettman was put in charge, the reality is the constant changes to the game are becoming tiresome, particularly when they are being more and more geared to the fans in the US "tastes". Gimme a break!

What about Yserman?

[sbaldrick]

Dallas is in Texas.  They don't even have snowplows there.  And lets face it,  on the first snowfall of the year Ottawa drives seem to have problems too for some reason.

[classmate]

I don't understand how Washington and Pittsburgh draw such low crowds with guys like Malkin, Crosby, Ovechkin, Semin, etc. Just mindboggling.

I can tell you Pittsburgh is "Steeler" country to the point of nauseum.   

I don't know why Football and Baseball is so popular in the US and Hockey is not on that list.  I don't think the NHL is doing a good job in "getting the word out" and promoting it here either.  The only time I see a Hockey commercial is when I am watching hockey on CI or MSG.  I only live a few hours from NYC yet all I hear about are NY GIANTS and NY KNICKS.   

[momr]

I can tell you Pittsburgh is "Steeler" country to the point of nauseum.

I don't know why Football and Baseball is so popular in the US and Hockey is not on that list. I don't think the NHL is doing a good job in "getting the word out" and promoting it here either. The only time I see a Hockey commercial is when I am watching hockey on CI or MSG. I only live a few hours from NYC yet all I hear about are NY GIANTS and NY KNICKS.

I could be wrong, but I think its a more Canadian/American thing.  I think hockey is perceived as Canada's sport - so the Americans aren't interested.   They will take notice and buy tickets if the team in their town is winning though

[thirstymoose_2000]

Dallas is in Texas. They don't even have snowplows there. And lets face it, on the first snowfall of the year Ottawa drives seem to have problems too for some reason.

Just on the FIRST snowfall?

[rose]

What about Yserman?

Sure..Stevie Yzerman or Mario Lemieux or Wayne Gretzky or Bobby Orr...there are lots.  Jean Beliveau would have been a great commissioner, IMHO.

I picked Brendan Shanahan because he was the player who called his fellow players together during the lock-out to try to help work things out, etc.  He seemed very proactive.  I also think he will say what he thinks but in a diplomatic, substantive way.  I am sure there are other worthy candidates.

I just never could, or ever will, be able to take Bettman seriously as someone who has the game's best interests at heart.  He is not a 'hockey man', IMHO.  I think he might be an excellent businessman and there has to be the financial component in the organization.  Marketing, selling the game, etc.  are all important.  But someone who loves hockey can surround themselves with good business people and make decisions for the league based on both components....not JUST selling the game to Americans. 

[thirstymoose_2000]

But someone who loves hockey can surround themselves with good business people and make decisions for the league based on both components....not JUST selling the game to Americans.

Bettman has surrounded himself with hockey people, and the board of governors have a lot to do with what happens with the NHL. So whats better - a business person (who learned his trade with the NBA) who surrounds himself with hockey people, or a hockey person who surrounds himself with business people?

In reality, it is the board that sets the direction, Bettman faces the task of getting it done.